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Holly Township Clerk says citizen petition snafu was a ‘misunderstanding’

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Written by Amy Mayhew
Friday, June 22 2012

Clerk Karin Winchester

HOLLY, Michigan – Having taken the advice offered by Holly Township officials in April, Holly resident George Kullis assembled a citizens’ petition and gathered what he thought was the required amount of signatures. In doing so, it was Kullis’ hope that the Holly Township Board of Trustees would consider creating a November ballot proposal that would allow voters to weigh in on whether the board should remain at five members, or increase to seven.

On April 18, township officials discussed the matter, and in a vote of 3-2, rejected the idea.  At the time, Clerk Karin Winchester explained that the township had been required to place it on the November 2008 ballot after the township reached a certain amount of registered voters.  


Treasurer Mark Freeman agreed, saying that the voters had already spoken to the issue four years ago, having turned it down by a margin of just 23 votes.  “Now to put it on again, it should be, in my opinion, a citizens’ petition because the voters already voted on it, and they voted it down,” he said at the April meeting.

George Kullis


Kullis said he is in favor of expanding the board to seven based on the fact that currently, administrative positions held at the township equate to the majority vote of the board, and that having three board members occupy the same office space can potentially cause Open Meetings Act violations. “The three wage-earners in that office make up the majority of the vote – it’s kind of like making the fox in charge of the hen house,” Kullis said.  

Days after the April meeting, Kullis said he spoke with Winchester, asking her how many signatures would be necessary on the petition in order for the board to reconsider.

“She told me I needed 10 signatures,” Kullis said. “I told her we had that many people sitting in the room that night of the meeting – 10 signatures sounded like a ridiculously low number, but she said there aren’t really any guidelines to follow, and said that it just had to come from the people.”

“I never would have said he needed just 10 signatures,” Winchester said Thursday. “I said he would probably need 10 percent of the number of people who voted during the last election – not 10 people – he must have misunderstood me.”

Over the course of two hours, Kullis gathered 13 signatures, and promptly returned the petition to Winchester.

“She looked at it and thanked me for submitting it,” Kullis said. “That would have been the time for her to say that I had misunderstood what she said,” he added. “Not a month later during the meeting.”

Repeated follow-up phone calls to Winchester for additional comment went unreturned.

“Ms. Winchester’s job is to help serve the public,” Kullis said. “If there was a problem, she should have brought it up then and helped me with it.”

During the meeting, board members discussed how many signatures should be required, eventually settling on 590 – that is, 10 percent of the 5,950 registered voters who voted in the last election.

As for whether or not Kullis can spearhead an effort to gather the nearly 600 required signatures by the township’s next meeting in July remains to be seen.

“I don’t know if time will allow it with the Fourth of July holiday coming up,” Kullis said. “It would probably take a few days of gathering signatures at the supermarket or what have you – I just don’t know if I have the time to do it,” he added. “This whole ‘misunderstanding’ just cost me another month.”

Comments   

 
#1 Toddski 2012-06-22 08:31
me thinks we have a fox in the hen house!!
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#2 vhogan 2012-06-22 08:59
Unless something has changed over the past several years, I do believe that the signature requirement is 10% of those who voted in the last "governor's" election. It was designed that way to prevent citizens from using the numbers from a smaller election with lowest turnout. The governor's election usually brings the highest number of voters to the polls.
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#3 Janet Leslie 2012-06-22 09:38
In this case, Vera, I don't think there is a specific requirement for signatures. The matter will or will not be placed on the ballot by decision of the board. In April, Supervisor Lambert asked the board to consider adding the matter to the November ballot, and could have done so without a citizen's petition. Mr. Lambert and I voted yes. The majority of the board voted no, and explained that they would only consider the matter if it were initiated by residents. There was no specific number of signatures discussed at that time. During the June meeting last night the board specified that we would require signatures equal to 10% of the township voters in the last presidential election. This does not mean that the board will vote in favor of putting the matter on the ballot, only that we will consider it if the specified number of signatures are presented.
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#4 vhogan 2012-06-22 09:44
That was the rule with recall elections, 10% of those voting in the last governor's election. Perhaps it's different with other ballot questions. I just know the rule was initiated in order to prevent the 10% being calculated from a ballot question such as mosquito control or something like that.
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#5 Ryan Bladzik 2012-06-22 10:20
Why does the township board get to decide how many signatures are needed for a ballot petition? That's ridiculous!

The board declined to put it on the ballot, saying that citizens needed to put it on themselves, but then the Board has the authority (lacking anything in the code of ordinances) to set an arbitrary target for citizen support?

What's stopping them from requiring some absurdly high number for initiatives they don't agree with? Why isn't the process hard-coded into the code of ordinances so that it's fair in any circumstance?
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#6 vhogan 2012-06-22 10:31
The Michigan Secretary of State or Oakland County Clerk can give you the exact rules and regs, and the number of voters in last big election.
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#7 Mark Freeman 2012-06-22 10:53
I have been unable to find any General Law Townships in the State of Michigan with a seven member board. Can anyone else help with this? All the General Law Townships in Oakland County have five member boards. Evidently the voters want smaller government with lower taxes.
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#8 localyokel 2012-06-22 11:02
You have GOT to be kidding me. ANOTHER snafu from the Clerks office? Amazing that these misunderstandings keep occurring. Who are we kidding–I smell another unjust action and the stench smells awfully familiar. People, its an election year. Exercise your right to vote, get involved & watch what is going on in local politics. Read between the lines–the foxes do not want anyone to challenge their power. They do what they want, when they want & are paid for it out of your tax dollars. Who are they accountable to? We the people, who are watching the continued calamities of that office. They are re-writing existing policy,creating new precedences & generally doing what suits their agendas NOT what is in the best interest of our community. Now this, an unclear matter that is made even muddier because the current“in-house” administration does not want their kingdom scrutinized. If there were two more trustees, then the vote could not be controlled by an office that has already been under the suspicion of collusion. This is MY opinion but I certainly hope others will see that the continued ongoing problems in this office calls for a change of administration. Problem is, it appears, that even if the “required” number of signatures are collected, the existing board will still have the final decision on whether or not to allow to return it to the ballot. If it only lost by a few votes 4 years ago,its likely to be something that people are interested in & lets hope that’s the case.
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#9 Janet Leslie 2012-06-22 12:36
Just to be clear and to avoid any unnecessary fear on the part of residents, at a cost of approximately $6,000 per year (or $3,000 per trustee) adding two trustees to the board will not require higher taxes. Township residents will continue to pay 1 mill for the services the township renders, with or without the additional board members. Our budget is balanced and our fund balance is healthy, especially as our revenue sharing with the state has increased with the results of the 2010 census.
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#10 HappyHollyHobo 2012-06-26 17:50
How is it that AGAIN there is a "misunderstanding" when it comes to Karin Winchester's knowledge or lack of the resident's rights as far as any election challenges? Isn't she supposed to be the township clerk? It seems that it "appears" that someone is trying to challenge the little "club" at the township hall, she declares ingnorance of the official procedures. I will vote for ANYONE that runs against her. So between myself and my family, she has already lost 6 votes. Maybe Snyder could use someone like her on his staff?
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#11 Holly 2012-07-03 10:31
Come on do you really believe Karin told him 10 signatures? That seems totally ridiculous, she would have to know that would get her more bad press.
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#12 hollyshopper 2012-07-03 21:04
You would think she would see that, Holly, but sometimes arrogance is blinding. Remember, no one has ever challenged this woman before. Winchester was appointed to the postion of clerk many years ago, and since then, she has made it through every election with no one running against her. She's not used to having to watch her step.
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#13 Concerned Holly Resident 2012-07-04 11:10
Karin Winchester is anything but arrogant and has served our community well over the years. This whole thing smells like a set up from the regressive Kullis, Leslie, Lauinger, Musgrave Group. How is it that Kullis misunderstands what he was told and it Winchester's fault. Why wasn't Trustee Leslie and Supervisor Lambert included in his accusations, they were asked the same question. Sure smells if you ask me! who wants bigger government anyway! Sounds like the Regressives have an agenda and need more of them tpager their way. The people said NO in 2008. What ever happened to for the people, by the people.
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#14 Ryan Bladzik 2012-07-05 12:11
Just out of curiosity, when was the last time there was a citizen-initiated legislative petition in Holly Township?
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#15 Jesse Lambert 2012-07-05 16:00
I respect all points of view on this matter, everyone is entitled to their opinion no matter how humble it may be.

However, I tend to view accusations as just what they are; accusations. They add little value to the overall discussion of any topic, they also cause harm when attempting to advance community goals and objectives. Goals and objectives that become seriously strained every election cycle.

To those circulating petitions of all varieties, keep at it. I think I speak for all community leaders when I say that no amount of resistance you experience now, will hold a candle to what you will experience once elected to office. Everyone is going to want a piece of you, be sure to establish motive early on and try your hardest to maintain a positive attitude.

As for the aforementioned ballot initiative, I supported it in 2008 as a voter. I also voted in favor of this item as an elected official. I've experienced little as Township Supervisor that could have even been used when considering a change of mind. I stand firm on my vote, then as well as now.

With no guidelines or policy regarding the circulation of petitions for ballot initiatives, the Holly Township Board has now chosen to fall back on State Law. For those who care to read the section of law pertaining to petitions and signature requirements, a link has been provided.

legislature.mi.gov/.../...

Holly is a General Law Township and most if not all Townships under this classification of government have adopted some form of State legislation. Holly Township is no exception.

It isn't all that unusual for General Law Townships to adopt State law before crafting a piece of legislation that suits the needs of the community.

The board has made its decision and will await the necessary number of signatures.

Keep in mind, the whole world can read this forum. We don't want to put off organizations that could be beneficial Holly. Be vigilant as to what message you are attempting to convey. Help maintain and take ownership of the positive image we've all worked so hard to earn.

Enjoy the rest of the week.
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